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ericwi

Dirt bikes in the national parks?

ericwi
18 years ago

In a proposed comprehensive re-write of administrative rules that govern the national parks, powered off-road vehicles would be given increased access to the national park system. Jet skis, dirt bikes, snowmobiles, and 4-wheel atv's will be able to enter and use areas that have been historically off-limits. The new rules are proposed by Paul Hoffman, appointed Deputy Secretary of the Interior in 2002. There is opposition to the proposal coming from a group of retired Park Service employees.

My personal sense is that people visit the National Parks to get away from noisy activity, and will be disappointed if they encounter dirt bikes on woodland paths. I find the proposed rules incomprehensible. The concept lacks common sense. Is anyone in charge over there?

See "Island Park News," online, dated September 9, 2005.

Comments (21)

  • vgkg Z-7 Va
    18 years ago

    Don't know Paul Hoffman?...any bets that he worked on Bush's 2000 election - great "interior" experience learned there no doubt ;o)

  • marshallz10
    18 years ago

    What can we do? The consumer market for Chinese dirt bikes, ATVs, jet skis, etc. must continue to expand or we'll go into a recession. :)

  • meldy_nva
    18 years ago

    What can we do? -- Wait for gasoline to hit $10 per gallon. If no one else, the wildlife and National Park trekkers will be appreciative! In fact, $10 pgal might even curtail joyriding, SUVs, and thrice-weekly shoppers ... which surely would improve the quality of air to everyone's benefit.

  • carolb_w_fl_coastal_9b
    18 years ago

    I don't know if I'd count on that, Meldy - what kind of mileage do dirt bikes get, anyway?

    I know when I had my Vespa (many years ago), the tank only held 2 gallons & lasted for @ least a week - & I was riding it across town (6-8 mi.) 2X daily.Are dirt bikes similar?

    I heard a comment the other day RE: current appointments to gov't agencies - basically, M.O. is to appoint people who want to destroy that agency & let them do it from within.Witness all the former industry lobbyists now in charge of regulating the very industries they lobbied for.

  • meldy_nva
    18 years ago

    Carolb - Maybe the dirt bikes would be used for local transportation? You're right, I think the overall mpg is good, although (with all that revving) I doubt it's as good as the Vespa. In our locale, the dirt bike usually requires a SUV for mommy to drive junior to an acceptable 'trail'... and SUV's get noticeably fewer mpg! My hope would be that mommy decides junior can ride a regular bike to the local park, rather than spending $20 just to get to/from the dirt bike trail.

    re: gov't appointees. I grew up with the phrase "kicking upstairs." It meant the employees would lie like h*ll to get rid of an unsatifactory boss by praising his [non]efforts to his superiors so that they would give the dud a raise and a job elsewhere. Bad part is, there are only yea so many stairs to be kicked up before the dud's new job affects *everyone*. Hoffman's proposal appears to be an example of what can happen when the dud gets to the top landing.

  • lilyroseviolet
    18 years ago

    Some national parks like Acadia National Park has lakes with in its park boundries that supply the drinking water to local residents nearby and to the town of Bar Harbor, etc.,

    I cant see motor vehicles having use of a watershed that is reserved for a towns water supply. SO hopefully we wont be seeing motor vehicles in the parks- would that not offend the wildlife ...just too controversal cant see it going through.

  • tplife
    18 years ago

    There are actually some people that think that the Nat'l Parks should be shared by everyone for recreation, including street-legal dirt bikes that have always been legal in the parks as long as they stay on established roads and use Forest Service-approved muffler tips. My Harley-Davidson thinks that it could be a dirt bike, but at 1556 ccs and 800 pounds I think not. Next it will want a leather seat with a claim that a renewable material like leather (basically fur that has been shaved) would be a nice change. What are these machines thinking, and what other conspiracies lie in this issue?? : )
    Where I live the fees paid by ATVs to use public lands have been used to close recreational areas. Can you imagine the nerve of the users to complain about this?
    I am a Forest Service plan commentor, and more land will be closed off to public use, new restrictions against the public are due to take effect in 30 days. This is "reform".

  • carolb_w_fl_coastal_9b
    18 years ago

    I heard they 'climbed down' on that proposal - so - moot point now?

  • wayne_5 zone 6a Central Indiana
    18 years ago

    I'm not an ATV lover and think that we would be better off without them except for certain legit uses.

    Even the Sahara Desert is being damaged by off road vehicles ...with sand blowing in that delicate environment.

    I think that fortified Landrovers might be ok for travel in African big game preserves. I still chuckle remembering footage of the vehicule being bammed repeatedly in the side by a rhino.

  • kingturtle
    18 years ago

    I'm very concerned. Somewhere recently I read that there was a new law or policy requiring the NPS to give equal consideration to recreation as well as conservation. Before, there was more erring on the side of conservation and preservation of the wilderness character of parks whenever an issue such as this (dirt bikes) came up. This will mean more roads into wilderness areas, more off-road vehicles, and more private concessions/amenities where there were once primitive trails only for the adventurous. I tried to find a link to this story, but can't find it now. Did anyone else see this?

  • althea_gw
    18 years ago

    It sounds familiar KT, but I didn't come up with anything with a quick search. I did find out the the American Recreation Coalition is an advocate for increasing motor vehicles in parks. Here's their website page of members.

    Here is a link that might be useful: fun outdoors!

  • paalexan
    18 years ago

    "I'm very concerned. Somewhere recently I read that there was a new law or policy requiring the NPS to give equal consideration to recreation as well as conservation. Before, there was more erring on the side of conservation and preservation of the wilderness character of parks whenever an issue such as this (dirt bikes) came up. This will mean more roads into wilderness areas, more off-road vehicles, and more private concessions/amenities where there were once primitive trails only for the adventurous."

    Actually, I'd agree that for national parks recreation and other forms of use should be a priority. But the idea that this means more roads, more ATV's, and more infrastructure is absolutely absurd. All of those things prevent national parks from realizing their recreational potential.

    Patrick Alexander

  • meldy_nva
    18 years ago

    Do those folks on motorized dirt bikes/ATVs ever actually look around at their surroundings? My impression is that they use those vehicles for the challenge of using them in awkward areas combined with a pleasure in the often excessive noise the vehicle produces (and don't laugh - I've been told by several aficionados that the 50+ decibel growl is "gorgeous" and "a part of the experience" - although I doubt the native inhabitants would find the passing roar agreeable). I think it's okay if those folks think driving dirt roads is recreation, but why should their choice of dirt roads be permitted to destroy any formally preserved natural habitat? I'm reminded of the early days of drag-racing, where the local guys got into their souped-up cars and went roaring down the lanes -and sometimes through town- just for the "fun" of it. Nevermind that pets, people and drivers were often injured, siometimes fatally, it was a thrill that the racers thought they had a right to, and it took quite a while to get those egotistic drag-drivers off the public roads and onto specific race tracks. IMO, the ATV-driver demands to use public parklands seem to be twist on the drag-racer's use of public roads; more like that of a bully: they want it so getouddathe way, they gonna take it.

  • carolb_w_fl_coastal_9b
    18 years ago

    Good point, Meldy - about the noise factor - how many wild animals stick around for any length of time in noisy environments?

    Just stumbled across this - I knew of the group/site, but hadn't looked @ it in quite awhile....

    http://www.npsretirees.org/news.htm

    Here is a link that might be useful: NPS Retirees News

  • ericwi
    Original Author
    18 years ago

    President Theodore Roosevelt was instrumental in creating Yellowstone National Park, along with other national parks set up back in the early 1900's. Roosevelt was a member of the Republican party. I wonder if he would feel at home in today's Republican party.

  • cochiseaz8
    18 years ago

    I'll bet not... I am a rider of dual sport motorcycles, but I would NEVER in my wildest dreams think of "f'roading" in and area that that was sensative, endangered, pristine and not designated,,, and them that do really torque my shorts, it gives all of us a bad name

  • sable_ca
    18 years ago

    Yellowstone National Park was created in 1872, when TR was about ten years old.

  • meldy_nva
    18 years ago

    Well, Congress voted in favor of it, and President Ulysses S Grant signed the bill for it to become a National Park, 3-01-1872.

    Here is a link that might be useful: a brief history of Yellowstone NP

  • xbreaka_gmail_com
    18 years ago

    Hi guys, first post here I live along the cape cod national seashore on cape cod, mass a historically ATV/Dirtbike unfriendly area unfortunely :(

    I just thought id provide some insight, Throughout most of the cape stretches a cleared area, probably about the size of a football field in width which has powerlines in the middle, and large access roads on each side aswell as some areas have a paved bike trail which runs off to the side, Alot of these powerlines are on town lands, and atv riding is generally allowed, however for me the area of the powerlines I live on is governed by the electric company, aswell as the NPS which leads to some problems.

    Heres a sattelite photo-
    The black line, shows the powerline route http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v259/xbreaka/Pit.jpg
    If you follow these powerlines to the south of where I live you reach a large sand/gravel pit which is now closed but the owner allows riding there. I have always riden on the powerlines, but today I was stopped by the rangers and issued a 300$ ticket for it?

    1.I have several problems with this, first off the info is not posted anywhere, iv scoured google, and the cape cod national seashore website trying to find a spot where it says "ORV riding under the powerlines is prohibited" and have failed to find it.

    2.The ranger vehicles themselves are much bigger than my dirtbike, and cause much more damage to the access road than I ever have.

    3.They threw the book at me for it, I will be contesting the ticket however in the district court, I dont expect to win but will not tolerate getting ticketed with disturbing of wildlife(nothing lives on or around the powerlines its all sand), tresspasing on private property(the pit owner gives atv permission to ride there).

    Its these things than infuriate me, sure I dont condone riding in the habitats, in the dunes or in disturbed areas. However this is just ridiculous, riding on a all sand access road, which is uninhabited by any threatened or endangered animals or wildlife.

    The Cape Cod ORV community is slowly disapearing because of the actions of people like the ranger who stopped me, riding in a place where you dont disturb anyone, dont damage anything and then getting ticketed for the most BS offenses iv ever heard.

    Frustrating Sometimes.

  • ericwi
    Original Author
    18 years ago

    xbreaka, I sympathize with you, but I'm not surprised by the fact that you were ticketed for riding a dirtbike on Cape Cod. In 1950, there were fewer people and fewer houses on Cape Cod. No doubt, people got away with operating noisy motorcycles and hot-rod cars. I'm not sure that it was a simpler time, but there was more space, and less conflict around outdoor recreation. I am guessing that it is local homeowners who object to your motorbike, not necessarily the National Park Service. When I see people riding ATV's here in Dane County, Wisconsin, they are generally riding on trails that wind around the cornfields on their own farmland.

  • xbreaka
    18 years ago

    Ya I guess I understand, However I use a very quiet pipe for the most part and unlike what most people think not all OHV owners "get off" to how much noise their bike makes, ontop of that I know most of the homeowners around here, I am always courteus when I see dogs,horses and generally people. I turn off my bike and wait for them to pass by. I rarely see many riding the area I ride on probably because its relatively remote at each end is a paved road occupied usually by rangers.

    But I see how a few might not take kindly to be riding on the road, however most seem to not mind and even crack jokes, like ah those morons closed another trail up there just thought id like to let you know.

    I have some pictures ill be cirrculating soon around here showing the comparision between the damage on the access road by me, and by the rangers multi-ton GMC suburbans. Needless to say it might not sway anyone but it clearly shows what hippocrits they are for trying to say I am ruining any sort of environment under the powerlines.

    Sincerely, Xbreaka

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